OIL GONE OUT OF THE POWER STEERING

[tb303]

I am going to buy a 1992 calibra 4x4 turbo with approximately 90000 miles. I live in Cyprus. The car was imported from UK. I took the car for a test drive today and the guy selling the car who probably knows s**t about calibras like i do, said that there is no oil in the power steering because there is a problem with a power steering hose or seal or something. So the wheel was heavy like a normal car without power steering. Please note that there was no 4x4 or any other warning light showing up on the panel, except a "check engine" indication that came up once or twice in a half hour's run. As stated at <a href="http://www.carpages.co.uk/go.asp?session=7@2@134610@442290@686" target="_blank">http://www.carpages.co.uk/go.asp?session=7...4610@442290@686</a> site those guys can make a 4wd conversion to a 2wd. Would it be possible that the same thing has happened here? I don't think that there are any calibra experts here in Cyprus to have done such a job, however YOU being the EXPERTS could give me some guidance in what to check or what to look for on the particular calibra. There aren't many in my country (probably 20-40) so I realy want to get this one if there is no serious problem. Is it a serious problem that there is no oil in the power steering? I think i read somewhere that it is one single pump that works for both the power steering and the transfer box. If there is no oil in the power steering should't there be a warning light coming up? Would the transfer box break? How will i know that the cars 4wd isn't working?

I hope i havent wasted your time by not being a UK citizen, however if there is a broken transfer box on the car i will need a good deal from you lads to get one pretty fast.


Cheers,

Tio

[Stupink]

Hi, welcome to the club, it is not a UK only club so you have no worries at all, make yourself at home..

BIG warning sirens are going off while reading your post, it sounds like you need to do some more research before buying a calibra turbo, it will get expensive otherwise..

Firstly yes, the 4x4 runs off the normal power steering system, if you have no oil for pas then the 4x4 will not be working, if you have no warning lights then you know it has been fiddled with already as it should have one to indicate low PAS pressure..

secondly, just taking the cap off the PAS is not eought... you WONT see the level on any turbo just like that... to check the level you must remove the cap, put the ignition on but do not start the car, then lightly pump the footbrake 20-40 times until you hear the small ball near the top right of the engine bay stop making a squirting noiise as you press the brake pedel(hard to hear over the noise the pedel itself makes, so maybe a frriends help..
After that you can then check the level, the high mark is the level when the oil is warm, the lower one the level when cold..
The engine light could be a lot of different things also.. definately worth checking out before ytou buy the car, could be cheap could be a significant problem..

just try to wheelspin the car on pulling away in first gear to check the 4x4.. if you can get any wheelspin then its not working.. which without pas fluid it shouldnt be.

converting to 2wd can be done by anyone in some curcomstances, depending on why the 4x4 died in the first place, the difference is that the transferr box will be left in place, where as a propper conversion will remove it all.

Does the 4x4 light come on at all when you put the ignition on like the rest do as self-check?

my guess is that the transferr box has blown its seals, doing this it allows the PAS fluid to flow into the main box case under pressure, so it just squirts out the breather.. the guy has probably removed the 4x4 blulb to stop it lighting up..
I think its one to walk away from without further investigation.. unless you have a lot of money and somene to help you sort it out.

[Kieran_Burns]

Quick check to see if the bulb has been fiddled with - start the engine with the brake pedal pressed. The 4x4 light WILL stay on.

If it doesn't then the bulb has been removed.

[tb303]

I havent found many for sale to choose from!!! As I have told you there arent many in the whole country. So when the guy fills the steering wheel with fluid should i try to wheelspin to check whether the 4x4 is working? Should i also check if a fuse or a light bulb has been removed?

[tb303]

what would the warning lights for no pas fluid look like ?

[Stupink]

there isnt a no pas fluid light, however as i said in my frist message a standard fully working 4x4 system should flag up a 4x4 warning light with no pas fluid.. that looks like |-| is amber and below the temperature gauge..
If the pas is working and you can wheelspin yes that means dead 4x4.. to be honest the car shouldnt be driven without the pas fluid, it might damage the pump, and the steering column, and the transferr box assuming it isnt already dead..

when you first put on the ignition, make sure the light described above comes on, thats the 4x4 light, it shoudl come on and go out after a few seconds unless you leave your foot on the brake as kieran suggests, then it should stay on till you release the footbrake.

I understand there arnt many, but you are honestly better off with a different car than a bad condition turbo.. like i said, unless you have lots of money and are happy to spend on them.. in which case it would be good to get another one in the ownership of someone who will repair it and look after it [img]/smile.gif[/img]

[tb303]

it seemes to me that this car was looked after by its owner. It is just that it probably got **** up by the guy who has the car park. So would it be possible that there is a steering wheel hose leaking oil and the 4x4 is still working? Should the 4x4 light come up and the go off or should it stay on flashing? If it does come on and then off without further flashing what would that mean? That it is ok? I mean the worst scenario is that the guy will have to replace the transfer box at opel garage or something? Is it standard that the transfer box should break without pas fluid? Wouldn't be wiser though that since there is no pas fluid in the power steering and the transfer box that the 4wd drive is bypassed and the car is working on 2wd just like when the transfer box has blown its seals? Should I 100% be expecting a blown transfer box? No other scenario is possible?

[Stupink]

Anything is possible.. as you say the 4x4 wont work without the pas fluid, however it should flash up a code (light staying on or flashing is bad news, it should come on with ignition then go out a few seconds later).
If you see no light it is still possible it could be working, the bulb could be blown, or removed previously if the 4x4 died and the box could have been fixed since but the bulb not replaced..

even if the light comes on and goes off, it *could* still be broken, there are several ways to make it appear to be working when its not, you must still test it by trying to wheelspin, if you can do this on soft/wet grass/mud you'll see if you get two or four skid marks.

Ah so this is from a garage? sorry, i mistook it for a private deal, its possible just a pas hose is leaking or something, but if the guy himself doesnt know much then its quite likely it is the box that is throwing the oil out, easy enough to see as the transferr box breather or the hose coming off it if its still attatched should be easily visible, just run the engine and pour a litre or so of PAS fluid into the reservoir and see if it comes out there or elsewhere... If it was just a simple PAS hose leak, i would have thought he would have fixed it already thats all!!! a bit of pipe to join it up temporarily isnt exactly hard in most places.

Just go with an open mind and try to think of all possibilities, don't let the limited choice you have force you into buying it unless its what you want. if everything turns out to be ok, then you can move onto the usual basic checks.. It would be worth getting that ECU light fixed also, the one that comes on occasionally, it will probably just be a sensor of some form, but if your buying from a garage then thats up to them to fix it before you take it on, it shouldnt do that so there is a problem somewhere although probably nothing major if its still driving fine and staying off most the time.

Don't rush into anything [img]/smile.gif[/img] any questions or doubts feel free to ask [img]/smile.gif[/img]

[MickM]

If there is no power steering fluid in the car then you should get a 4x4 light. If not, then the bulb has definately been fiddled with. 99 times out of 100, if the PAS system is empty it has probably been emptied via the TX box pressure seal meaning that your 4x4 is shagged. You can rig up a bypass as shown on my website below.

<a href="http://homepage.ntlworld.com/betyouaint/Calibra%20Turbo.htm" target="_blank">http://homepage.ntlworld.com/betyouaint/Calibra%20Turbo.htm</a>

Doesn't sound good though and running the car without PAS fluid will not do the PAS pump any favours either.

Eskimo on holiday in Wales breaks down at the side of the road. The tow-truck turns up to sort the problem and the Welsh mechanic suggests, "I think you've blown a seal". The Eskimo replies, "So what, you f**k sheep!!!".

[tb303]

First of all, thank you all very much for your help and your patience with a newbie like me. The car is from a garage however i am not pretty sure if the guy doesnt know anything about calibra or whether he is playing his part trying to fool me. I called the guy earlier and told him to fix the steering wheel leak as he said that it is the only problem with the car, so that i could take the car to my mechanic to test it. He said he will look after it first thing on Monday morning. How much does a transfer box cost? I will drop the asking price of the car by much if it is the transfer box. the rest of the car is in excellent condition.

If he gets the problem fixed i will try the wheelspin method. If not then i won't since i don't want to damage the transfer box. Furthermore, will the transfer box be working with no pas fluid? I am 100% sure that power steering is not. It is heavy as an ordinary car without pas. Therefore i dont think that the 4x4 will be working either so why should i test it by wheelspin? The guy has said he'll fix the hydraulics problem. I dont give a damn if he thinks that it is only the pas and he tries to fool me with the transfer box. I can be rough. Besides i am paying. I will proove to his boss who happens to be an old colleague that his sales representative is trying to rob me so they'll get it fixed anyhow. Just point me to the right direction for a cheap transfer box please. They'rer paying for it..........

[Stupink]

transferr box fitted from vauxhall is about £4,000 i think , no one has had one done for a while so i dont know what they charge these days.. A reconditioned box is about £1000 fitted from VTS which is the company you linked to earlier, obviously they cant fit yours but they can probably supply, as can <a href="http://www.cav16.co.uk" target="_blank">www.cav16.co.uk</a> who are the other main reconditioners.

<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I am 100% sure that power steering is not. It is heavy as an ordinary car without pas.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
To be honest, it might be working then, the calibra PAS steering is quite heavy, it just enables you to turn quicker rather than making the steering lighter, when the PAS is dead it becomes Very heavy and difficult to turn corners, for those with a small build it might be all but impossible to drive...
As i said in my first post i think it was, the pas fuild cannot be simply checked by opening the top, if the garage owner really is clueless about the cally turbo, then thats all he might have done, if possible try to check it yourself wtih the method i descibed above.. If there is still fluid in there then the 4x4 might still be fine, if it really isnt working at all and the light isnt on then as mick confirms it really is a very bad sign.

[Mel]

If the problem is just a leaky pipe, then refilling the reservoir with steering fluid will not be enough. There will be air locks. You need to bleed the hydraulic system as below. Print this off and give it to the mechanic.

<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->6) The system must now be bleed so follow the bleeding
instructions below.

Remove Fuse 19
Open bypass screw on shift valve approx 3 turns. (This is the
alan key on the top of the brass block next to the accumulator)

Start engine
Top up subsiding fluid level immediately to MIN and allow engine to
run for
approx 5 minutes.

Turn steering to stop and hold in this position for approx 5 seconds
repeat
process to left and right.

Close bypass screw for 20 seconds and open again
After another 20 seconds close bypass screw.
Switch off engine.
Insert fuse and switch on ignition (do not start)
Actuate brake pedal approx 25 times. (this opens and closes the
pressure switch to transfer box)
Check fluid and top up if necessary
Start engine and run for 1 minute and stop
Check fluid. (press brake pedal 25 time with ign on)


How 2 - Accumulator<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

The accumulator and block are at the back of the engine bay on the nearside

[tb303]

i am sure that the 4x4 light comes up when i turn the ignition on and then goes off. is there a panel lights description somewhere to check what light stays on please?

[Mel]

Try this link for all you need to know about the 4x4 and transfer box

<a href="http://cav16.co.uk/transfer/" target="_blank">http://cav16.co.uk/transfer/</a>

[tb303]

MickM
Thanx for the info mate. Whatever the problem is the guy at the garage is commited to fix it if he wants to sell the car. In case everything is working fine after the fix and i get to buy it, how do i make the mod you are describing in your site? Do you have more information on this please? "A common modification is to add a switch that allows the driver to manually select 2WD when 4WD is not really required (long motorway journeys) theoretically prolonging the life of the system." I hope you can help me on this one.<b></b>