Brakes

Any issues relating to suspension, steering and brakes.

by MarkV6 » Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:23 pm

(Slightly OT forum mods but I feel I have to reply this way...)

Johnny A wrote:I love the way MarkV6 you have cut up my sentences to make me look stupid.

That wasn't my intention at all. I break up peoples 'posts' when replying to more that one thing. I feel it is easier replying to one point at a time rather than having to read through everything first.


Johnny A wrote:I am fed up of arguing with you, I have tested and tested and learnt from my own mistakes on what works and what was essentially a waste of money that could have been better spent elsewhere.

Two posts hardly constitutes an argument in my eyes.
My first post was merely stating the difference from my four year old std brakes to a big brake kit. I will also be the first to admit that probably it was/is a waste of money as I'd never use them to their potential on the road. I'm not a fan of the big alloys/tiny brakes look so for me the only option is a bigger kit.


Johnny A wrote:I could easily correct you on some of what your saying because some of it is pub talk and some of it is true, but your not going to listen so why bother.

Please do so, then I will know where my knowledge is lacking. I wouldn't like to misguide users on here with misinformation.
As for not listening, on the contrary I will always be open to increasing knowledge
There was a MarkV6 on migweb who asked you about getting the Omega intake under a Calibra bonnet, guess who that was....

Despite what you may already think I'm not an a$$hole.

Stupink wrote:What tyres you currently have? that's definately the best first place to look to spend.. I run parada spec2

Was referring to my first Calibra back in '00-'01, not my current one
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by v6 steve » Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:41 pm

heres my plan
new 308 discs
new pads
new fluid
braded lines
new tyres
that should at least make me feel safer when in the beast
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by tazz666 » Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:43 pm

heres my plan
new 308 discs
new pads
new fluid
braded lines
new tyres
that should at least make me feel safer when in the beast

so your not going for the anchor out the window idea mate,lol
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by Fraz » Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:48 pm

Oh don't get him started buying boats
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by Stupink » Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:50 pm

Don't be too concerned. you'll soon get used to the power change. its quite random owning the same car and having it go quicker, if you swap the car then it feels natural. but when the car you used to know suddenly starts getting to corners quicker than you're used to, it feel a bit wierd lol. i noticed that when i binned the phase1 ecu for the phase4 lol. but my phase4 runs std turbo brakes and they are perfectly fine for road use :) i just press pedel harder lol.

Mark, my tyre question was at steve, there are a lot of "ok" road tyres out there, but only a few that are ok for quick cars really :)
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by v6 steve » Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:54 pm

Mark, my tyre question was at steve, there are a lot of "ok" road tyres out there, but only a few that are ok for quick cars really

Stu iv only got budget tyres on as i needed new ones to get to Billing so im going to get good ones and put the budget ones on the se2 or i might just burn them up and down the street lol
Oh don't get him started buying boats

can you get v6 boats ? mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
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by Stupink » Wed Nov 05, 2008 1:04 pm

heavier car, more heat created when braking so needs bigger disks to distribute the heat.

bigger brakes are a good idea. im fairly sure no one is suggesting otherwise, but there are better areas to spend your money first, and also when upgrading should consider if you want to do them all around not just huge ones at the front. :) you'll find the cars you talk about have brakes equally as mahooosive at the rear.

Definately sounds like steve wants to spend his money on tyres first for example here.. then afterwards consider brakes with a higher duty cycle
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by tazz666 » Wed Nov 05, 2008 1:10 pm

on a serious note , i have ebc grooved and drilled discs and red dot pads and my tires are goodyear f1 eagles and it stops really well and the discs are just standard size
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by Naz » Wed Nov 05, 2008 5:48 pm

For road use, brake upgrade is useless! If you obide by the law, you would never get to the 3figure mph. So you don't need to have bigger brakes. You need to improve the cooling. So fit drilled and grooved discs.

on the other hand, for trackday use/race use, then yes. The problem with brake fading is the heat. Either brake fluid overheating, or the discs and ...

You could upgrade to bigger discs and ... for track use.

Stu > If you use bigger calipers, surely the pedal travel is more, as more fluid needs to be dispersed for the pistons to move?! so, although you might get better feel of the pedal, you get more travel before they become active?!


i am not digging at ANYONE's comments, just my thoughts.
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by Stupink » Wed Nov 05, 2008 7:20 pm

yeah, thats right, if the caliper area is more you must move the pedel more, hence its easier to press but you have to move it further to compensate. im not sure if that was a question or a statement though lol :)
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by Stupink » Wed Nov 05, 2008 7:55 pm

yeh, bigger disks have more torque on the wheel as they're further away from the bearing.. but the extra piston area/fluid deffo makes more power, its kinda like its geared, same as a hydraulic ram. to get more power you use a bigger cylinder diameter that moves less distance, to get more movement you use a thinner cylinder but get less force as a result.
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by MarkV6 » Wed Nov 05, 2008 8:16 pm

Can I throw in another 'theory'??

Say the standard caliper piston area is 100mm/sq, could you have a 4 pot caliper with piston areas of 25mm/sq (25 x 4 = 100).
Overall the piston area is the same, but spread out over a greater area so you would need bigger discs as well.

So bigger discs have more torque on the wheel as the pads are further from the center, but because the piston area is the same surely roughly the same amount of fluid is needed to move the pistons?

Otherwise all the 4/6/10 pot kits for sale should recommend an upgraded master cylinder to move the extra fluid required? Plus the extra pistons can't be too big because of the caliper dimensions to fit behind various wheel sizes...
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by Stupink » Thu Nov 06, 2008 12:09 am

Na its deffo easier. Hydraulics is same as leverage, bigger arm is easier to apply more force but needs longer throw.

If one syringe produces 10psi over one square inch of surface, and slave cylinder is two square inches, it still has 10psi but over both those inches so has 20lbs but master only has 10lbs to create those 20lbs.
Same setup with smaller slave only 1inch you'd get 10lbs both ends.

Having said that I have been trying to get to sleep the last hour lol! So maybe I'm talking tripe! Lol.
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by v6 steve » Mon Nov 17, 2008 9:10 am

Sorry guys to bring this back up but.
Went out in the v6 dry road doing about 70mph hit brakes hard abs off and it didnt lock up so it looks like im back to the drawing board,
The discs are being skimed tomorow as there is a little lip and pitting but i would have thought that they would have still locked up, they have passed the MOT 2 weeks ago
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by Mark1 » Mon Nov 17, 2008 9:41 am

The lip is not the problem and skimming is not going to help, never happy when people play with dics, I'd say that you may will have air in the system still.
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